But ti was touching to see you recognize how horrible it is to have someone falsely describe your religion and tell you why you’re bad because of a belief that you don’t really have. Welcome to the club.

God’s sovereignty makes a great caricature

the irony of ironies, though , while typing this back and forth, the revelation hit..: SO THIS IS WHAT IT’s like to be misunderstood….. :-) just another day at the office for an LDS I suppose, as an evangelical this happens not so often (for now)

agreed on “evangelical” pretty much scoffing at defintion…

Agreed. The real problem is that no one seems able to pin down what “Evangelical” really means. So folks like you get lumped in with people loudly spouting doctrines you reject.

It’s a very big ocean, Jacob, and perhaps you already know that. Let me put this another way. If I were to present Geoff’s descriptions to the ev’s I hang with, they’d get a big charge out of it. Nothing to take too seriously, maybe the same way you feel about a lot of material on the anti-bogs. So beware the generalizations, that’s all.

I’m new (less than a year) to blog-dom, but Spencer’s comment about Calvintists taking up major bandwidth (disproportionate to their numbers) seemd to ring true to me.

To Geoff: many ev.’s do have as narrow a view of salvation as you’ve portayed. I know that I’m not that happy about it, and neither is N.T. Wright and a host of up and coming theologians. The view of salvation is much more wholistic and all encompassing than the narrow view that some have (foolishly) chosen. Again, one can be thoroughly “evangelical” and reject such a narrow framing of this glorious truth. In honesty, this is ONE of the conflicts between what some are calling the emerging church and more traditional churches, and most non-denoms that I’m aware of would not want to own the “salvation as escape from hell ” picture. Your point has merit, but to equate it with “the evangelicals” goes too far, in my opinion.

GERMIT

Your comments here seem to be ignoring that we were having a real live conversation with *actual* evangelicals and we were taking on their professed beliefs. This is not some thread were we made up a straw-man about evangelical theology (despite Todd’s unsupported claims). So your call for Geoff to “get out more” is off base. We had evangelicals actively participating in the discussion and although they couldn’t defend their positions at all, they agreed with Geoff about what those positions were.

on 03 Apr 2009 at 12:13 am iMonk
Martha:

I have no idea what Christian denomination Everyday Mommy belongs to. She only lists the non-denominational Cambridge declaration on her website and no church affiliation. So please don’t associate her with my denomination, Southern Baptists. I wouldn’t venture a guess.

What I will say about Southern Baptists is this (NOT speaking for them or for me. Just painting with a broad brush.):

1) They are not confessionally committed to rejecting Catholics as Christians.

2) Many of us believe that many Catholics have a simple saving faith in Jesus, no matter what else they may or may not believe.

3) I think the majority of our team would say the RCC is in serious error, but there is sufficient truth in her teachings to be genuinely saved.

4) I’ve met very few Southern Baptists who reject the salvation of all Catholics.

5) Most Baptists would attempt to clarify the Gospel, Biblical authority and justification by faith alone with a Catholic friend.

6) The average Baptist suffers more from ignorance about Catholicism than a belief that all RCs are lost. This is partially the RCs fault for being so complicated. The explanation given over at EMs for Mary NOT being worshiped is plain to me now, but there’s a lot to be explained, and then there are all those Mexican Catholics who appear to be, well…you know.

peace

May GOD’s mercy find and console us
GERMIT

not sure what to label it myself, even WITHIN one particular fellowship, the views held that answer your talking points would very widely at MOST ev. churches, though this depends on how conformist that preacher wants to push his own “micro-othodoxy”. For example, in my church, there are differing views of what ‘inerrancy’ means exactly, and many different eschatologies. That’s just getting started.

haven’t yet had time to read all the posts above, but I look forward to it (I think….)

in all things charity
GERMIT